Best NAS for Capture One/Photo Editing

[Furbz85]

Hi Syno-Users!

I am brand new at this forum, so please forgive me for any mistakes I've made in finding the right place to start this post.
I have been using the search function, but I have not found any answer nor question that gives me the right info.

First the story:
At this moment I am using a big array of drives for my photo storage. I am a photographer.
Two years ago I bought a DAS (WD DUO) for archiving my photo's -> JPG backups in the cloud.
From 2015 to 2018 I have been using WD single drives for archiving photos. Always two pieces, so I have kind of redundancy.
In some cases I stored pictures on my Home Use NAS DS215j. But lately one drive failed: it fell of the table as my USB hub did
not stick anymore. And there the problem began. It was the one disk I had only one single copy of files on. (Yeah, stupid.. I know ).
So, I have to fix this problem en make a better workflow and redundant plan: Synology.

My old Ds215 is only a two bay Raid 1 device. And it is fairly slow.
I began my search for a NAS for incorporating in my workflow but I have hit a road block.
I don't know what to get. Here are my findings.

DS918+ (before 920+): No NIC possibilities, expandable storage and DSM (I like DSM)
Ds1618+: NIC possibilities, expandable storage and DSM. But it is a two year old device and I think I understand that this device is not good at streaming to
Plex per example.
And then the 920+ drops. But still no NIC nor 2,5/510 GBE possibilities.

In all honesty: I have been looking at the Q's as well. They offer a bit more 'future proof' option. But I am not
familiar with them and I like Syno.

My Question:

Is a 1Gbe Lan speed enough for photo editing? (I use Capture One Pro 20). Files are average of 25/30MB and I shoot about 2000 files
a wedding. I'm thinking about 4 drives in SHR or RAID 5.
Is it smarter to buy the 1618+ and forget about the streaming hiccups.?
Does anyone have any experience with Syno and (bulk)editing? Do you use 1GBe?

In short: what NAS to buy? I would like to be a bit future proof. But if 1GBe would suffice, than that will be okay.
I hope you can enlighten me with some info.
I am sorry for the ridiculous long story, but I have tried to give as much info as possible.

Thank you so much in advance.

Ferdi
PS: I know that NAS is no backup, but gives only redundancy.
PPS: I am not in need of using Dockers and stuff (as far as I know).

 

[Rusty]

Welcome to the forum 1st.

In short, you will have to choose. If Plex streaming is important for you but you can be sure that you will not need to transcode, my suggestion would be to go with 1618+ (and a 10Gb adapter). You can then use an aftermarket 10Gb adapter for your computer and be 200% certain that you will not have any problems editing off the NAS in real-time

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On the other hand, if Plex streaming with transcoding is needed then you will have to compromise with a model that doesn't offer 10Gb or go to a different vendor.

Another option would be to get several hundred gigabytes large DAS device (SSD or NVMe) and use it as an editing device on your computer and use another Plex capable NAS for storage to offload (like 918/920).

 

[Furbz85]

@Rusty Thank you so much for your reply and welcome.
Whilst reading I beginning to doubt the fact wether I really need transcribing or not. In this day and age
of Netflix it becomes more useless to get your movies from anywhere else. But still..
Do you think the 1618+ is a bad investment? I mean: I hope there will be a 1620+ this year.
I do not have the need to buy immediately I think.

It is indeed a choice. I am curious: are there any Synofans using the 1GBe connection that use
Editing sotware combined with their NAS? Is it doable? What do you experience?

 

[Rusty]

Do you think the 1618+ is a bad investment?

Let me ask you this. If you bought this model lets say 1-2y ago, would you change it in 2020 or 2021 if it was working just fine for your needs? Guessing you wouldn't. There are no major problems with this particular model so I personally still see it as a model that can, in these specific scenarios, really deliver.

I hope there will be a 1620+ this year.

Well, it's not impossible but still, it will not come in the next few months like the rest of x20+ models. If you are in no hurry, I would suggest to wait then.

Is it doable? What do you experience?

Personally I don't work with large files in that way and I guess that your professional needs might be different from the next photographer. Still, saying that, it also depends how fast you expect your work to be completed and are you actually having problems atm, and if you do, what kind exactly.

There are members here who will definitely be able to give you a more closer example and feedback.

 

[WST16]

Hi,

I’m a photo hobbyist but I’ve never considered editing on the NAS (not my 216+ II at least with 1Gb port), I’m not convinced.
I edit on my iMac (SSD) and transfer the end results to the DS for safe keeping. Of course I understand that your case is different (being commercial).

My suggestion is why don’t you test it with your current DiskStation?
The bottleneck in this case will be the network. The results won’t be far from what you’d get with a 920+ (both are 1Gb).

 

[Furbz85]

Let me ask you this. If you bought this model lets say 1-2y ago, would you change it in 2020 or 2021 if it was working just fine for your needs? Guessing you wouldn't. There are no major problems with this particular model so I personally still see it as a model that can, in these specific scenarios, really deliver.


Well, it's not impossible but still, it will not come in the next few months like the rest of x20+ models. If you are in no hurry, I would suggest to wait then.


Personally I don't work with large files in that way and I guess that your professional needs might be different from the next photographer. Still, saying that, it also depends how fast you expect your work to be completed and are you actually having problems atm, and if you do, what kind exactly.

There are members here who will definitely be able to give you a more closer example and feedback.

That is true! Perhaps I met acknowledge the fact that editing on SSD and transferring isn't a bad idea. I'm not collaborating in home, so that wouldn't be a big problem. It's more: the idea of future proofing my gear is a soothing idea. In that case I'd better wait for the 1618 upgrade. Though you are right: 1 year ago it would be a no brainer to buy the 1618+. Sometimes it is just too bad tech gets refreshed too often (whilst others might think differently about this)

 

[Furbz85]

Hi,

I’m a photo hobbyist but I’ve never considered editing on the NAS (not my 216+ II at least with 1Gb port), I’m not convinced.
I edit on my iMac (SSD) and transfer the end results to the DS for safe keeping. Of course I understand that your case is different (being commercial).

My suggestion is why don’t you test it with your current DiskStation?
The bottleneck in this case will be the network. The results won’t be far from what you’d get with a 920+ (both are 1Gb).

Thank you for your reply @WST16
At this moment I use about the same workflow as you.
I dump originals on the DAS as backup and I edit of my T5. When finished I backup the edits on the DAS. But a on trick workflow would be nice to have.

I have indeed tried it and it was meeeeeh. But with the 215j I bottleneck at about 80mb/s because I can utilise only one drive. I assume that using SHR or RAID 5 will max out the 1GBe at 110MBS. That would be an increase of 40%. But I can not tell if that will suffice or not.

 

[WST16]

I assume that using SHR or RAID 5 will max out the 1GBe at 110MBS

I don’t think so. Don’t forget that there will be the parity overhead being written to the disks (and more CPU consumption for calculations). With a Single disk, there is no parity overhead.

RAID 0 will be the fastest. But with no protection. RAID 10 is good but expensive.

I still think the bottleneck is the network.

 

[WST16]

The main reason for your investment in a new NAS is the photography business. I would try to satisfy that first and find alternatives to achieve the other requirements as much as possible

Therefore, a 1618+ (or its replacement) is more suited IMHO. It’s quite an investment (including network upgrades) but well worth it over the long run. Having 6 bays will be more versatile too. You can dedicate a single drive for media if you don’t care much about losing them, 4 drives in RAID 5 (SHR), 5 drives in RAID 6 (SHR 2) or 4 or 6 (2+2+2) drives in RAID 10 for a fast and resilient albeit a much more expensive solution.

If I’m considering such a solution (for business), I’ll try very hard to go for RAID 10 if the budget permits, this way I’ll avoid rebuilding failed (RAID 5 and 6) arrays and rely on mirroring with the fast disk stripping for editing.

For media, you can use something like Infuse and an Apple TV. The heavy lifting will be done by the ATV (so no reliance on the NAS capabilities). I’ve tried it with my 120j just to test it and I was impressed. It won’t be as powerful and flexible as Plex (when it comes to control and organization), but it’s an option. You can try the free version with your current NAS and see.

Having said all that, If I were you, I’ll try to find a way to test a 10GbE Synology NAS to see how suitable it is for what you’re contemplating, before throwing all that money on one

 

[jeyare]

As I wrote somewhere in this forum:
More than 60k photos in one of my DS1813+
Photo resolution from 1Mpx in jpg to 24Mpx in Raw. 80% of the data space for the 24MPX RAW.
RAW = 27,6MB/photo
Adobe Photo CC environment

Storage architecture

Primary site:
DS1813+ setupt 4x1Gbps in LAG connected to Unifi 48p managed switch (LAG)

RAID1, 2x 3TB HDD Seagate Constellation with avg 180MB/s .... then I need min 1 440Mbps throughput for the LAN
... now is utilized for 1.6TB from 2TB expected and 3TB possible (RAID)
why expected? Because speed of the disk decrease slowly from >50% size utilization and from 75% rapidly

last mile (desktop = editing computer) have 2x 1Gbps NIC (then 2048Mbps)
then I have achieved 100 RAW photos migration for 15 seconds, what is great for me

Import of the RAW photos into NAS by USB3 SD card reader connected directly into the NAS (really fast)

Backup site:
local DS1811+
local External eSATA disk
remote DS1813+

and I don't have a bad dreams

 

[jeyare]

ofc this configuration (in DS1813+) is running 5years w/o any crash or disk fail

 

[jeyare]

My Question:

Is a 1Gbe Lan speed enough for photo editing? (I use Capture One Pro 20). Files are average of 25/30MB and I shoot about 2000 files
a wedding. I'm thinking about 4 drives in SHR or RAID 5.
Is it smarter to buy the 1618+ and forget about the streaming hiccups.?
Does anyone have any experience with Syno and (bulk)editing? Do you use 1GBe?

In short: what NAS to buy? I would like to be a bit future proof. But if 1GBe would suffice, than that will be okay.

2000 files you need import to NAS from SD card.
Then
2000 x max 30MB= 39GB ... then you will use direct import from SD to NAS by SD card reader connected to NAS. Peanut for the USB 3.0 port

You will never edit all 2000 photos in one edit sequence.
Just you need make import new photo into a Photo catalog (sorry I will use Adobe phrases). One time. Never again. It's up to you where you will store your catalog, but better is in the desktop side (SSD and backup it to NAS). It's fast and useful and secure for your mental health in case of some ...

Then for the edit and save process you need transfer few photos from NAS into your desktop. Then 1Gbps network is absolutely enough. Still suitable for Panorama with 100 pictures.

As I wrote I have 4x1Gbps LAG from NAS to Switch. There is just 2x1Gbps for LAN and 2 rest for WAN (1024/150 WAN FTTx). Then I have between NAS and the desktop side 2Gbps throughput, what is from such scenario enough for next x-years.

For better speed between NAS and desktop you can use such configuration:
RAID0 from max 4 disk as primary site
automatically synced into next 2x disks in RAID1 (in same NAS)
two bay for Spare disk (in case of the RAID0/RAID1 degradation and restoration, you can sleep better)
Then 8bay NAS is beast for your job.

 

[Furbz85]

Thank you all for the advice. In summary: Buy the big unit .

@jeyare : I've been looking at LAG. but it still isn't really clear for me how I can get
that working on an iMac. I have 1 port.
Would it work like this?:

2/4 port LAG from nas to LAGswitch. CAT6a to a 10gbe(or 5Gbe) to thunderbolt adapter ->iMac?
What are your thoughts on this?!

 

[Furbz85]

The main reason for your investment in a new NAS is the photography business. I would try to satisfy that first and find alternatives to achieve the other requirements as much as possible

Therefore, a 1618+ (or its replacement) is more suited IMHO. It’s quite an investment (including network upgrades) but well worth it over the long run. Having 6 bays will be more versatile too. You can dedicate a single drive for media if you don’t care much about losing them, 4 drives in RAID 5 (SHR), 5 drives in RAID 6 (SHR 2) or 4 or 6 (2+2+2) drives in RAID 10 for a fast and resilient albeit a much more expensive solution.

If I’m considering such a solution (for business), I’ll try very hard to go for RAID 10 if the budget permits, this way I’ll avoid rebuilding failed (RAID 5 and 6) arrays and rely on mirroring with the fast disk stripping for editing.

For media, you can use something like Infuse and an Apple TV. The heavy lifting will be done by the ATV (so no reliance on the NAS capabilities). I’ve tried it with my 120j just to test it and I was impressed. It won’t be as powerful and flexible as Plex (when it comes to control and organization), but it’s an option. You can try the free version with your current NAS and see.

Having said all that, If I were you, I’ll try to find a way to test a 10GbE Synology NAS to see how suitable it is for what you’re contemplating, before throwing all that money on one

The 10GBe is indeed expensive: therefor a 10gbe NIC slot would have been awesome on the 920+. That would make the whole thing a no-brainer. The Q's are more versatile at that point. But to me Syno is just the way to go.
It's just a feeling

 

[WST16]

The 10GBe is indeed expensive: therefor a 10gbe NIC slot would have been awesome on the 920+. That would make the whole thing a no-brainer. The Q's are more versatile at that point. But to me Syno is just the way to go.
It's just a feeling

Indeed, QNAP seems to be always one step ahead when it comes to the features offered but (to me) Synology has the finesse. Sometimes, less is more

 

[jeyare]

for the 10Gbps LAN you need NAS with RAID0 with more than 3x SSD (MLC) to be able utilize such huge bandwidth, then better scenario is 4x1Gbps NIC at NAS side to manage LAG and others useful setup (for better price).
Otherwise you will get fast 10G LAN, but really slow NAS environment.
There is also the client side point of view and possible 10G NIC.
You can read about in our Resources.

 

[jeyare]

Thank you all for the advice. In summary: Buy the big unit .

@jeyare : I've been looking at LAG. but it still isn't really clear for me how I can get
that working on an iMac. I have 1 port.
Would it work like this?:

2/4 port LAG from nas to LAGswitch. CAT6a to a 10gbe(or 5Gbe) to thunderbolt adapter ->iMac?
What are your thoughts on this?!

be sure what kind of switch you will use!
Switch with >2xports for 10Gbps SFP+

but in this (recommended above) case is better and simple to use 5Gbps/TB adapter at client side and utilize 2x 1Gbps LAG at NAS side or 3x1Gbps. For such usage it’s really enough.

 

[WST16]

And while you’re at it, throw in one of those latest Mac Pros and don’t forget the $700 optional wheels

(@Furbz85 fumbling through the closet looking for the house deed )

 

[Furbz85]

be sure what kind of switch you will use!
Switch with >2xports for 10Gbps SFP+

but in this (recommended above) case is better and simple to use 5Gbps/TB adapter at client side and utilize 2x 1Gbps LAG at NAS side or 3x1Gbps. For such usage it’s really enough.

Do i understand correct that lag will benefit my overal speed on 1 client? I thought it would be only beneficial for serveral users envoirements: or am I wrong.
if I buy a 1gbe switch with lag support and I connect it through 1 cat6a via ethernet to thunderbolt then I am rocking a 2/3gbe connection to a single client? (imac in my case)

 

[jeyare]

Do i understand correct that lag will benefit my overal speed on 1 client? I thought it would be only beneficial for serveral users envoirements: or am I wrong.
if I buy a 1gbe switch with lag support and I connect it through 1 cat6a via ethernet to thunderbolt then I am rocking a 2/3gbe connection to a single client? (imac in my case)

LAG mode in Syno NAS has 4 different setup modes, based on Linux Bounding driver. For mentioned case is best solution based on IEEE 802.3ad Dynamic Link Aggregation. But each other have important role for different scenarios.

this is the right wording for your mentioned scenario:
- any client will benefit from LAG when you will arrange End to End LAG environment based on IEEE 802.3ad with Link Aggregation Control Protocol (LACP) between the Client and Switch.
- client is desktop client or NAS

An example:
Your NAS with BOND 3x1Gbps for LAN, LAG mode 802.3ad
Your switch with specific ports connected from the NAS configured to 802.3ad, also for each clients (deskstop PC with more than single NIC)
Then you will get "aggregated" 3x1Gbps link between NAS and the switch
In mentioned case you will send packets from 5Gbps interface (Ethernet/TB adapter from your MAC) to the switch = single NIC.
done