Is the ubiquiti dream machine an acceptable router?

[NAS Newbie]

In a previous thread, @jeyare had shown me how I could use ubiquiti unifi hardware to basically unite 2 separate physical locations into one secure virtual network so that I could monitor cameras at the separate locations.

I see that the Dream machine combines the router, switch, and access point into one unit. I believe that it can still be used to create the virtual network. For a relatively basic user like myself, there any reason that I need to buy my ubiquiti networking hardware as separate components instead of bundled into the dream machine? I have no need for more than the 4 ports on the dream machine.

 

[jeyare]

so, let’s open this topic.
First, I need to write - I never used this device, but with understanding of the Ubiquiti targeting we can discuss about Pros and Cons.
Second I don’t like All in one devices, but it’s my own attitude . Of course it can be great entry point for newbies to Ubiquiti network family.

Ubiquiti Unifi Dream Machine

Router, switch and AP in single box. In Unifi word they integrated to this box also Controller.

Acronyms
UDM - Unifi Dream Machine. Few days ago.
USG: Unifi Security Gateway. Release date 2014
USG-Pro: Pro version of USG. Release date 2018

Comparison of important technical features

	UDM	USG	USG-Pro
CPU	ARM Cortex-A57
cores​	4c	2c	2c
Frequency​	1.7 GHz	500 MHz	1 GHz
Special Feature​	n/a	with Hardware Acceleration for Packet Processing	with Hardware Acceleration for Packet Processing

Note:
don't be full and don't compare different CPU architecture. It is common misleading for newbies. More important is packet forwarding performance indicator in pps - packets per seconds (see below).
In UDM they use 4c CPU for operation of 4 different devices (router, switch, AP, Controller). Question is how it will manage such operation. I see it as bottleneck.

RAM	2GB	512 MB	2GB
	DDR3	DDR2	DDR3

Ports
LAN	4x 1 Gbps	1x 1 Gbps 1x 1Gbps VOIP	2x 1 Gbps
WAN	1x 1 Gbps	1x 1 Gbps	2x 1 Gbps RJ45/SFP

So here is the more important data performance indicator - packet size performance.
An example:
when you forward 64Bytes in Layer 3 with speed 1,000,000 pps, you can forward 61,03MB/s = 488Mbps. Don't forget it is include routing protocols, inspect incoming packets, and NAT operation. For better understanding smaller packet size (64Bytes) makes heavy impact to the router performance. Then don't forget - more cores in CPU and more GHz in CPU is not always base of better PPS.

Layer 3 Forwarding Performance 64 Bytes packet size	n/a​	1,000,000 pps​	2,400,000 pps​
Layer 3 Line Rate for +512Bytes packet size	n/a​	3 Gbps​	4 Gbps​

I can't find performance indicators for UDM. What is strange, or intent from Ubiquiti . There is just mentioning, that integrated switch is managed. Nothing more. Not enough for me.

WiFi performance
both USG and USG-Pro don't have WiFi native AP integrated.
UDM has integrated 802.11ac Wave 2 4x4 MU-MIMO for 5 GHz and 802.11n for 2.4 GHz. This is similar spec as in my favorite AP Unifi Nano HD. Then for 5GHz network you can use setup of 4x4 (20/40/80 MHz) or 2x2 (160 MHz) High performance antenna. Perfect if you have small residence <100m2 (brick walls) or <80m2 (concrete walls) and your UDM is in center of the flat. If no and you will expect full performed 5GHz speed, you need purchase additional AP or APs, of course from Ubiquiti for single management.

End of part 1

 

[NAS Newbie]

Thank you. Looking forward to th next installments of your discussion. I've seen on a couple different websites that several of the software features are still in beta. Perhaps this is why you cant find all the specs you are looking for? ubiquiti just hasn't decided yet?

 

[jeyare]

Thank you. Looking forward to th next installments of your discussion. I've seen on a couple different websites that several of the software features are still in beta. Perhaps this is why you cant find all the specs you are looking for? ubiquiti just hasn't decided yet?

nn
Unifi controller for USG/USG Pro is in regular and stable operation - I have 3 last versions in my Docker for tests new features/upgrades, one (winner) in regular operation (active). This is my favorite feature when I can operate my Unifi controller through Docker container(s) = easy and fast roll back.
see here

I don't know, why some vendors (Syno also) hide some information.

 

[jeyare]

Part 2

UDM Switch is missing PoE ports (not mentioned), or port for an injection of PoE. Then you have to purchase:
- PoE adapter for each PoE required device connected to UDM. Also you need solve how to plug the PoE addapter to nearest (frequently missed) electr. socket. This is a disqualification of the UDM for me.
- additional (it is possible) UniFi switch with PoE features (plenty of them). Then the UDM lose the advantage of all in One. Still usable for many of users.

But if you don't need PoE devices, you can forget for this missed feature.

 

[jeyare]

Part 3
I can't imagine how the IPS/IDS system will run, when UDM has single CPU for all in one operation (router, switch, AP, Controller). But needs to wait for tests.

Waw - and this is for me final stage:
You can't manage UDM from another Unifi controller. Then all of you, who would like to run Unifi controller in Docker (NAS) can forget for this useful feature!!!

Then you can't prepare and manage multiple sites!

Then I finally understand, this is really entry level device for easy home users.

 

[jeyare]

this is end of story from my side

Verdict:
- if you like use PoE devices like APs, IP cam, ... don't purchase UDM
- if you like operate more than single site ... don't purchase UDM
- if you like operate just wifi devices with max. 4 wired and you don't know more about networking, you can purchase this device.
This is entry level solution from Ubiquiti, solid for newbies. Nothing more.

 

[NAS Newbie]

Part 3
I can't imagine how the IPS/IDS system will run, when UDM has single CPU for all in one operation (router, switch, AP, Controller). But needs to wait for tests.

Waw - and this is for me final stage:
You can't manage UDM from another Unifi controller. Then all of you, who would like to run Unifi controller in Docker (NAS) can forget for this useful feature!!!

Then you can't prepare and manage multiple sites!

Then I finally understand, this is really entry level device for easy home users.

What feature am I looking for that says you cant manage the UDM from another unifi controller? I'm just curious what it is so I know what to look for when looking at specs of other ubiquiti hardware. Is there a specific name for that feature?

 

[jeyare]

this is valid only for UDM, because there is integrated Unifi controller in the box. All others Unifi range is free for “normal” controller usage - main advantage of the Unifi range

 

[jeyare]

you can purchase Unifi Cloud key - it’s Ubiquiti independent Hw for controller operation, but when you have NAS, it’s pointless

 

[NAS Newbie]

this is valid only for UDM, because there is integrated Unifi controller in the box. All others Unifi range is free for “normal” controller usage - main advantage of the Unifi range

Gotcha. So even if it is possible to bypass the UDM controller in favor of the NAS based version, I'd be spending money on the integrated UDM controller that isn't necessary.

 

[jeyare]

for exact PoE demand specification you need take into consideration a Peak (max) demand of the cameras:
Video surveillance cameras are the most complicated IP terminal devices as they not only generate enormous power peaks during re-set, day/night switching, heater switch-on, and windshield wiper activation, but also produce higher data rates and need higher overall PoE for functions such as pan, tilt, zoom, illuminators and wiper, etc.

For example

in such operation scenario you need count with 22W for the camera.
Then your final math must include 10% operation reserve:
2 PoE cameras x 22W Peak = 44W + 10% = 48,4W
+ PoE AP x 10,5W Peak = 10,5 + 10% = 11,55W
in Total = 59,95W
when you will purchase 60W PoE switch with 60W you will reach max capacity for these 3 devices. For additional PoE device you need repeat the purchase of additional switch. Then use your math carefully!

 

[jeyare]

for better understanding of electric loses in twisted pair wires and your right approach to setup of PoE wired networks, you need calculate many factors to find Line Loss, Maximum PoE Distance, PoE voltage drop ...

here is simple calculator include data validation, then you can't entry wrong values

 

[NAS Newbie]

What if I'm ok with the idea of not hosting the controller on my NAS? My main goal in getting this new router is to be able to set up the vlan for security cameras. Once setup, I will rarely need to monitor the remote site because it is in the middle of nowhere and I'll be pretty much the only user. If I have to login to it separately every once in a while for updates or something that's fine.

I'm very tempted to try a couple udms because going this route would be quite a bit cheaper than buying two sets of routers, switches, and access points. I've gotten along ok until now with a stock router rented from my ISP. I'm sure that gives you the chills just thinking about it, but it's also an indicator of my current network needs

 

[jeyare]

In middle of nowhere is pretty different starting point:
- someone smart can switch off your electric supply and when you don’t have backup from heavy battery or diesel engine - there is no camera that will help you
- someone stupid doesn’t need care about consequences from your records, then you need just worry about connecting conditions, because it’s main bottleneck of such places. Then also you can forget for fixed public IP (99%sure) for such place. Just dynamic IP from your ISP is possible.
Then the trouble is even worse:
- NAT and firewall rules in your primary site. You need know public IP address for middle of nowhere place. If no you can’t setup, establish and hold connection between primary site and remote site.
It can be solved by DDNS, but when you will operate different routers in each places, hmmm it will be tricky how to save your mental health to future Because low cost routers from ISP have limited features. And these low cost routers are vulnerable pretty much.

Finally there is still same question:
How much you can lose, then how much you can invest to the protection?

 

[benoitc]

I wish there would be a new USG to have fster throughput with IPS/IDS. Limiting to 85Mbps when your line is 1GBps is not really an option

 

[jeyare]

I wish there would be a new USG to have fster throughput with IPS/IDS. Limiting to 85Mbps when your line is 1GBps is not really an option

USG Pro with 1Gbps Fiber (nominal speed) with full IPS/IDS at 480-540Mbps (28 active NICs)
USG is much slower because my explanation (see above)
there is also second possible reason: Nominal vs Real speed from your ISP, but the first one is higher

 

[itsjasper]

PIcked up a UDM to compare against the RT2600ac, also to troubleshoot a new internet connection.

Setup was painless. Biggest issue for me was the lack of dual WAN. I was initially wowed by the UI, but dug a little deeper and found a few oddities. The newer v1.7 firmware seems to have fixed a lot of issues, but added a few more along the way. Also some of the features sem to be in 'beta' mode on the UDM.

I'm a little on the fence as to which of the two I'll ultimately keep, but the choice on whether to keep dual WAN connections will probably decide it for me.

 

[jeyare]

when you will carefully read all my review points(above), you will keep your mental health in right level.
UDM is box dedicated for people with single expectation = connection to internet for my wifi devices. This is traditional mass market product.

Also new UDM Pro is fail - new OS and no possible run in docker.

Unifi USG Pro is different world .... also new 4th generation. Suitable for Pro levels.
Then you can’t compare these two ranges UDM vs USG. It’s like Synology “j” class vs “plus”. Too different.

 

[itsjasper]

Each to their own, as the saying goes. I can easily compare suitability for my use case.

Actually, it was your review that initially got me interested in the UDM. All I really wanted was stability decent enough performance for a medium-end SOHO user and remote visibility of stats and troubleshooting capability.

I've leaned on the Synology's dual WAN capability during a transition from old 4G setup to new NBN, as I'm often away from home and can't rely on an untested connection when I'm not physically present to troubleshoot family internet issues, particularly in these WFH/COVID times. The UDM was initially acquired to help troubleshoot the new connection, as it didn't seem to play nice with the Synology at first.