Set up help DS1019 on imac for storage

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Set up help DS1019 on imac for storage

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Hello! I just bought a DS1019 and need help choosing the best set up options for it. I am coming from a drobo which was easy to set up, but after several problems with the support for Drobo I've decided to make the switch to Synology. I know Synology can do way more than my drobo which was a DAS instead of a NAS, but I find that also very confusing to set up. Let me explain how I want to use it and hopefully someone can help.

I am using an imac to access the synology.

I basically need it to run as a large external drive with redundancy. I only want one volume and want to be able to expand that volume capacity as I fill it up by replacing the smallest drive. (I'm a photographer with a lot of files, but I will also keep all my files on it rather than on my imac).

While I know I could configure it to be reached from anywhere, I would prefer it to only be able to be accessed from our house.

I need to be able to read and write the files from my imac, not sure what file system I need, but it needs to play nice with macs and I'm also not sure where I determine this.

Currently I have 4 8tb drives and 1 4 tb drive in it.

I believe I want RAID 5, but I did explore SHR, still not sure on the main difference between both of these, but I need to be able to replace drives if one fails and expand the volume as I fill it up. I would prefer to alway replace the smallest drive as needed so I think that's raid 5?

A friend said they hooked theirs up directly to their mac with a lan cable instead of going through a router, I have no idea if this would be an ideal setup for me, but currently I have mine attached to my imac with a lan cable and a lan cable to the router from the synology because the synology assistant didn't find it until I hooked it to my router. I can see it just fine now, but don't know enough about it all if I should connect it a different way.

I tried doing the create for the storage pool and volume but didn't know what to pick for my imac to read and write for either.

Do I have to make a shared folder on it once the volume and storage pool are set up for me to access the data from the mac?

Once I get it set up is there an easy way to transfer 9tb of data from my drobo to the synology beyond copy and paste?

Why does the Synology assistant find two servers? I just selected one, but do I have to do anything with the other one? It's all the same info as the first other than I did nothing with it. I'll attach that file.

Sorry for all the questions, but thank you so much if you can help a newbie with all this that wants to get back to photographing things rather than networking lol.
 

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fredbert

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Check here to see the storage you get between RAID5 and SHR 2 (2 disk redundancy, you'll need to select SHR 2 from the list) RAID Calculator | Synology Inc.

And some information about the difference between RAID and SHR DiskStation Manager - Knowledge Base | Synology Inc.

Next, whether you want to format the volume using btrfs or ext4 DiskStation Manager - Knowledge Base | Synology Inc.

It will probably default to SHR and btrfs. But the SHR can be upgraded to SHR 2.

Mac doesn't have native support for btrfs or ext4 but it doesn't need it because a NAS isn't directly mounted in Finder. You connect from the Mac using a file sharing service, such as SMB, AFP, SFTP, and WebDAV. Unless you want to use iSCSI and then you'll need paid third party software on the Mac.

Mac Finder has native support for SMB, AFP, and WebDAV. And you can use SFTP with apps like Transmit, CloudMounter, Cyberduck, and Mountain Duck.

As for Synology Assistant, once you've found the NAS's IP address you can login via the web GUI and never use the assistant again. I would recommend assigning a static IP to DSM (and fixing this in you DHCP server ... in your Internet router??) then you'll know where to find the NAS.

I think the reason you are seeing two NAS in the assistant is this: iMac is WiFi connected to router and then sees the NAS via wired LAN, and this is the one with the IP address; iMac sees NAS via direct ethernet but there's no IP addressing on this, so probably direct MAC address to MAC address or self-assigned 169.x.x.x.

If you don't allow the NAS to access the Internet then you'll have to manually download any software updates yourself, and check when versions change ... Package Center won't be able to check and alert you.

If you do want to have the NAS only as, well, a NAS then you can configure the Mac's ethernet interface with manually assigned IP and subnet and the NAS as the same subnet but different IP (e.g. 192.168.15.1/255.255.255.0 and 192.168.15.2/255.255.255.0). Then set the Mac's IP as the default gateway in the NAS. If you configure the NAS's DNS server setting to real IP then you will be able to share the Mac's Internet/LAN connection (or not, or occasionally).

Transferring from the Drobo: if the Drobo supports rsync you can use this with DSM's rsync service.
 
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Is the iSCSi when it tricks the imac into thinking it's an installed hard drive?
Does that still back up with the SHR so I have redundant storage?
Do I then format that drive to the HFS+ so I can read and write files to it?
I have crashplan for online backup, would the iSCSi solution work better with that for backing up the synology box online?

Thank you for your time, I greatly appreciate it!
 

fredbert

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Haven't used iSCSI but here's the Knowledgebase How_to_use_iSCSI_Targets_on_Mac_computers and iSCSI Manager

SHR and RAID are used to create a storage pool of the disks. With a storage pool you can create one or more volumes. A volume is what you format to hold data. The underlying SHR or RAID is irrespective to the file services that build upon it.

You'll need someone else to advise on iSCSI setup, if the links aren't enough. Also don't use Crashplan, but DSM's Hyper Backup supports backing up LUNs to local storage or another Syno NAS. Else use something on the iMac to do the backup.
 

Rusty

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Currently I have 4 8tb drives and 1 4 tb drive in it.
Keep in mind that with SHR when the time comes to change the drives it will be 4TB or bigger drives as a minimum upgrade.

Do I have to make a shared folder on it once the volume and storage pool are set up for me to access the data from the mac?
Correct

Why does the Synology assistant find two servers
Your 1019 has 2 ethernet adapters you are seeing them both and only one is connected to your router so you are getting an ip address on that adapter.

Is the iSCSi when it tricks the imac into thinking it's an installed hard drive?
It is

Does that still back up with the SHR so I have redundant storage?
If you configure iscsi lun on your shr volume then yes

Do I then format that drive to the HFS+ so I can read and write files to it?
Indeed. It’s presented as a imac native drive so you can run any format on it that macOS can work with.

I have crashplan for online backup, would the iSCSi solution work better with that for backing up the synology box online?
Personally I wouldn’t use crash but it’s your choice. There are other ways to backup syno iscsi lun but it’s something you have to decide on your end.

Keep in mind that nas was designed to be used as a nas not das. The fact that you can use it as a das device via lan does not mean it’s a good idea or working in all cases.
 

fredbert

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I just looked up Drobo DAS and seems it's a USB and/or Thunderbolt connection to RAID'ed 'big disk'. The chances are that these DAS connections would be faster to the iMac than the NAS's gigabit Ethernet.

Using iSCSI is effectively moving from DAS to SAN (on a NAS, using the spare ethernet as a dedicated interface).
 
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Keep in mind that with SHR when the time comes to change the drives it will be 4TB or bigger drives as a minimum upgrade.


Correct


Your 1019 has 2 ethernet adapters you are seeing them both and only one is connected to your router so you are getting an ip address on that adapter.


It is


If you configure iscsi lun on your shr volume then yes


Indeed. It’s presented as a imac native drive so you can run any format on it that macOS can work with.


Personally I wouldn’t use crash but it’s your choice. There are other ways to backup syno iscsi lun but it’s something you have to decide on your end.

Keep in mind that nas was designed to be used as a nas not das. The fact that you can use it as a das device via lan does not mean it’s a good idea or working in all cases.

Thank you! I would have preferred to stay on a DAS, but couldn't find another solution like drobo and synology was suggested by other photographers. While normally I'm somewhat techy I'm finding it difficult to set up. I basically want to turn the synology into a drobo with better customer support lol.

When you say that there are other ways to backup the synology do these include cloud backup offsite? I want redundancy for my drives here mainly for if a drive fails, but if I had a fire or something I also need some sort of offsite backup. With my drobo the crashplan worked great although it's taken at least a year for it to complete the initial backup :(
 

Rusty

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As it was already mentioned you can backup to another syno nas, a compatible rsync server or maybe Synology C2 cloud solution (paid).

basically want to turn the synology into a drobo with better customer support lol.
Yes, don’t do that or you will be very disappointed.

Certain Syno models support 10Gbit lan ports. With those and with a compatible Thunderbolt 10G adapter you could get a DAS solution you are looking for for you imac. That will give you a das speed while also having a nas pallet of functions.

To make it all complete, an SSD drives would be needed (some bays) to utilize at least 50% of that 10GB lan connection.

It’s a bit more on the initial investment but it might pay off for you.
 

jeyare

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@mickiedev
how much files did you expect to move between your imac and storage? In single batch. And how frequently? Also what is total batch size in MB or GB?

to be sure:
- for Nikon D5 Pro, the RAW file size is about 42MB (for each lower camera it’s smaller value). OFC when you have Hasselblad X1D or similar “gun”, you ned 120MB per RAW file
- 64GB SD card then contains 1560 RAW files
- such SD card you can transfer from your imac to NAS by 1Gbps ethernet for 8 minutes (still about 1560 RAW files)
- with 2Gbps LAG just for 4 minutes, in this case you need min MLC SSDs (you can forget for TLC performance). Is 4minutes too long? Then you can compare advantages and (more) disadvantages of DAS vs NAS.

Specially for Drobo systems, which are vulnerable as Swiss cheese. You can find here (use Search) Security comparisons from independent security tests.
 

Rusty

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Let’s not just focus on transfer. Maybe the idea will be editing off the nas as well.
 

jeyare

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Photo Editing is still about RAM and CPU of the desktop, even when you have direct connection (swapped) to NAS - there isn’t bottleneck at the NAS side. OFC in line with previous mentions (network, disks, NAS).

There is one break point, when you edit Gigaposter panorama contains 5000 pictures :)
 

fredbert

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I can see this thread being like some Skype IM chats I have where eventually we end up on audio because it's just so much quicker to nip out misunderstandings and think through possibilities.

@mickiedev what I would suggest is that you speak to your friend that has this setup already. Find out how they have done it and if it's fast enough. Also does their workflow match your's. It's obvious that this NAS has a specific purpose [business tool?] whereas the general-purpose nature [home, hobby, and business] of the Synology NAS is the attraction for others.

For more DAS-like speeds you may want to consider a NAS with 10GbE interfaces (either built-in or a slot for them) Product List | Synology Inc. and then, as @Rusty suggests, a 10GbE to Thunderbolt adapter for the iMac. I was going to say this before but was already very rambling and though it may get more confusing.

As for LAG (configuring the DS1019+ two 1GbE to work together for a combined 2Gb) and adding a 10GbE switch, plus a 10GbE to Thunderbolt adapter, I thought was getting complicated too. Also I'm not familiar with iSCSI: LAG helps with concurrent connections to the NAS but no individual connection can be greater than 1GbE (a single LAN port speed) ... if iSCSI uses more than one concurrent data connection then LAG would help.


When connecting using SMB or AFP from Finder the file share is mounted in Finder but you don't format it with HFS+/APFS, the SMB/AFP protocol handles the files and folders between NAS disk and Mac.
 

Rusty

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iSCSI uses more than one concurrent data connection then LAG would help.
It does. iscsi will use multiple lanes (because its using multipath; what everyone wants for Syno to implement on pure SMB protocol as well).
 

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