Just for kicks, if you have one-check it!

[Jan Janowski]

We have a Whole House Surge Protector attached to power company feed mounted outside - at home.

Couple days ago I checked for the “Happy Light” that I’ve seen for 13 years — And It Is DARK!

By next day I’ve talked with enough people and have scheduled a replacement with electrician this Friday AM.

That in itself is not post-worthy, but what multiple folks from multiple companies said - IS:

Apparently different MFG’s Surge Protectors have a somewhat finite life spans! 2 different folks says that the good unit we had installed during the build, they see lasting repeatedly failing at only 5-8 years, and ours lasted 13 years. We got our $$ Worth.

But note to all: CHECK THOSE HAPPY LIGHTS. — if it’s DARK you protection has ceased!

 

[White Bear]

Common MOV (Metal Oxide Varistor) surge protectors clamp down when voltage rises above a threshold. They divert excess energy to ground. Unfortunately, the MOVs will wear out over time. Every surge degrades them. They may continue to pass power to the load; but without providing any protection. They can also leak power line noise into the ground connection. It is generally recommended to replace MOV surge protectors every 3-5 years.

There is an alternative. Zero Surge, Brick Wall or SurgeX protectors absorb and dissipate surges through an inductor/resistor network. They don't wear out from surges. And they keep the ground clean; which is good for audio/video or network equipment. They can also suppress lightening-induced surges and power line spikes without failing - and without requiring replacement. Unfortunately, these devices are significantly more expensive, bigger, heaver, and not suitable for whole-house protection. But they will last for decades!

 

[Jan Janowski]

Thank you. Great information. Shame they are not available for home use!
I’ll know more Friday morning!

 

[White Bear]

Whole-house surge protectors are almost always based on an array of MOVs that will not absorb all of a surge. They clamp the voltage by shunting the excess to ground, but a portion of the surge (“leakage”) still reaches your household circuits. The size of that leakage depends on the design, MOVs used, and the standards they’re tested against.

In the U.S., UL 1449 (the standard) rates surge protectors by VPR (Voltage Protection Rating), which indicates how much voltage “leaks through” after clamping. For most residential whole-house units, VPR is usually 600V – 800V for line-to-neutral protection (common mode) and 100V – 1200V possible for line-to-ground or line-to-line modes. In practice, this means a 6kV surge (the UL test level) may be reduced to ~600–800V reaching your gear.

That’s why layered protection is best - with non-MOV point-of-use protection on sensitive equipment.

Also ask the electrician about Type 1 (before the main breaker) vs. Type 2 (after the main breaker). Type 1 provides better protection.

Consider asking your electrician to run a PQA (Power Quality Analysis) for at least a few days to give a better picture of power quality from the utility company in terms of voltage sags/swells, transient spikes, harmonics and noise, and frequency disturbances. Ditto (but for a few minutes vs. days) for generator. That should help inform your strategy,

 

[Jan Janowski]

Surge & meter is in power company box, in front of Generac Transfer switch. There is only one power line for the whole mountain, and with many intermittent issues, 90+% of folks here have generators. So I imagine any exam would indicate there is lots of issues with our power.
There is a high end hotel at mountain top paying for quick power reconnect, and that (only 1 power line) got us reconnected quicker after Helene which went directly over our house, and hammered anything east of us: Asheville!

With whole house surge, generator, and 6x UPS’s, I’m doing what I can to keep us good with what is available, where we live. This area was a mountainside forrest in 1990 approx 1-2 miles from road going up mountain.
Electrician just called: may do both Surge replace & Generator Service later today. If not Friday. I’ll ask about type 1 vs 2 install both original and new, and ask for type 1.
Thanks for the education!

 

[White Bear]

Given the frequency of lightning strikes in NC, it would be prudent to ensure grounding is in A+ condition at your house - both in terms of internal wiring and particularly earth/ground rods at the utility entry point. Depending on soil conductivity in your area, a single 6-foot ground rod may not be sufficient. Poor grounding makes surge protection - especially for lightning - far less effective. Another topic for discussion with the electrician. For what it is worth we ran into many complications with power quality and poor ground conductivity at our previous location, 7200-8600ft elevation.

 

[Jan Janowski]

There are 2 sets of grounds: one at house and one at garage. The cable system is grounded to garage, power at house.
The cable comes in via garage. Power comes in via house. Contacted both cable & power companies: They have separate grounds at the pole, 125’ away at pole, and transformer box on ground between house & garage.
Power & cable are only external connections to house.

 

[White Bear]

Code requirements (NEC 250 & 820): All incoming services (power, cable, phone, satellite) must be bonded to the same grounding electrode system. This ensures everything in your home shares the same reference ground.

You can get a voltage difference between the “cable ground” at the garage and the “power ground” at the house. In normal conditions, this might only create noise or hum in AV/network equipment. During a surge (lightning, utility fault), the difference can be hundreds/thousands of volts → destructive current flows through your NAS, TV, or other electronics to equalize the two grounds. Dangerous!

 

[Jan Janowski]

i count no less than 5 separate grounds. On our lot alone.
2 at pole above & behind garage, 1 at transformer box at lot line, that feeds me & neighbor’s house if he builds. 1 at house & 1 at garage. I asked both companies about lightning protection, and both said they ground every drop, at poles, so, it would seem that there are many 10’s of grounds or more up the mountain.
They were confidant it was ok, but suggested a whole house surge, which I had.
I asked after an issue of a direct hit above us 2017 or so. No surge, lost well pump +.

 

[White Bear]

Utility companies are concerned with protecting their infrastructure upstream from you. NEC refers to grounding of any service that enters your home.

 

[Jan Janowski]

I’m not an expert, but, in our Development alone, if there is 50 lots, with 40 cable feeds to those 50 lots, and each is grounded… I count 90 separate ground connections. Now if 40 of 50 lots are built on, and have one ground connection at the house: that number of grounds increases to 130.. More if there is a remote garage.. assuming no remote garages....
It’s hard to imagine how a 131st ground connection (at the very end of the line) would affect things over 130, and maybe that’s why power and cable company said system here is ok when asked years ago. And this is just one development. This is not to say a whole house surge is not needed. It is!
But I wll ask electrician about that when he gets here later today!

 

[White Bear]

Good plan. You've raised a few red flags worth checking out with a qualified electrician who is on-site.

 

[Jan Janowski]

Got the answers.
Replaced surge with Vortexx Series R1. Old one did not blow breaker. Nothing unusual seen when disassembled.
Yes Vortexx is an unlimited warranty
Old and new wired as Type 2. Could do type 1 install if power company would remove power. But it is ‘kinda’ a type 1 because it’s in front of the Generac Transfer switch.
But he did find a 15A breaker on old Surge. Replaced with 30A breaker on new Surge. I now know where this breaker resides too!
And last:
“Ancillary buildings with panels require Supplementary Ground rods”

Green, Happy. Red or dark: Bad!

Green. Happy, & Done!

 

[White Bear]

Good choice! Vortexx includes both thermally fused metal oxide varistor (TFMOV) - with thermal protection that leads to a longer MOV life - PLUS gas discharge tube (GDT) suppression, which acts as the first line of defense before the MOV comes into play. So that combination of technologies should provide a relatively long life for the unit as a whole. However, the Vortexx can still pass up to 700volts to the load according to their spec sheet.

I didn't realize there was a separate panel in the garage, so the supplementary grounds at each panel are required in that case. Not clear about the cable vs. power grounding. But if electrician says OK... Happy Green Light!

 

[Jan Janowski]

Wasn’t aware of the differences. He did say it is a “vastly improved unit”, over units 10years ago.. Thanks for input. You alerted me to stuff and a circuit breaker I didn’t know I had. that has now been updated!! I edited last post saying nothing unusual was found inside old unit. it just died.

Use my experience as a tool! Check yours!